Tuesday, July 24, 2018

battle rifle book 3


BATTLE RIFLE BOOK 3
CARBINES V BATTLE RIFLES
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You’ll have noticed by now that the book title does state “battle rifle”.  Yes, as a point in fact it should state “combat rifle” to be clearer.  A battle rifle is a military thirty caliber full size round whereas a carbine uses an intermediate size cartridge.  But to my mind, that is like arguing if the M1 Carbine was actually a carbine or if it was technically a submachine gun since its round was more pistol than intermediate powered.  The plain and simple fact is that the age of the true battle rifle is over and the assault rifle reigns supreme and most folks consider the poodle shooters the weapon to take into battle.
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I don’t like this myself, as I consider the full battle cartridge to be superior.  But I also see its very real weaknesses.  When you arm yourself with limp wrested ammo, you accept that a certain type of fighting is superior.  Namely, dumping a wall of lead at an enemy.  For almost all of the fighting taught and advocated today, the carbine is the only option.  The full thirty is for another kind of fighting, more worried about marksmanship than spray and pray.  When you fall in love with lead dumping, a big bore is simply too much rifle.  Even with a semi-automatic, the recoil is severe enough that you are wasting a lot of shots.  In the next chapter I’ll explain why this is a retarded tactic for the survivalist.  It shouldn’t have to be explained, but nobody likes that pesky Logistics problem.
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But let’s say, just for the sake of argument, that you don’t exactly agree with modern tactics and arms, and want to stay with the marksman ideal and you also believe that the full thirties are superior.  You’ll still have two low cost options, but you are trading a superior round for inferior arms.  That is, assuming you are on a severe budget.  I assume we all are, being realistic.  Some folks can puff out their chest and proclaim differently but I’d wager they need the wife’s permission to spend the big bucks.  Good luck with that, buddy.
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You might be forced to accept a carbine just because they are half the price, as is their ammo.  If your terrain and tactics force you to go full bore, you still can do it, but it is going to be tough.  And yet, a lot of folks might want a full bore because of conventional wisdom, because that is the advice out there, and not even need it.  Built up woods are usually not even 100 yard shots.  The traditional advice is that you need penetration.  And it is hard to argue with that.  But at short distances, is that really a requirement?  You’ve seen the video’s of short range cast iron skillet shooting with carbines, haven’t you ( hint, they went through )? 
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Let’s boil it down simply.  If you are a true marksman ( NOT a sniper-so few of us are that it doesn’t merit consideration ), AND your area allows it, a thirty cal big boy gun is great.  It has the needed punch out at long distances.  Otherwise, if you are an average shooter, you can’t utilize the full bores.  It is too much gun for you.  I have my Lee-Enfields, best military bolt gun ever made, and while I like the full power round, I know I’m really only utilizing its ability to fight the wind ( high desert here, wind is usually a bitch ).  It doesn’t do me much good past 200 yards, about my maximum effective hitting range.
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Am I concerned with penetration?  No.  I don’t have the extra ammo to be trying to shoot through trees or cars.  And, while penetration is great, that role really belongs to the squad automatic weapon.  Using the traditional battle rifle in that role is really not the greatest idea.  You are better off with a grenade launcher than a penetration rifle, anyway.  Yes, I understand survivalists cannot own one, so they opt for a penetrating rifle.  But I still think folks should be more concerned with flesh than cover.  Again, from Day One you should be trying to conserve your ammunition, not waste it. 
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The whole point in buying more ammo is to have it last longer through the apocalypse, not to waste more of it every battle.  That is the primary reason I dislike semi’s.  But I won’t digress.  As long as you use semi as a way to acquire another  target quicker, and not to place more rounds in the same one, that shouldn’t be an issue.  You’ll need to learn to disregard today’s tactics even if you have those tactics weapons.  Cover and suppressive fire is a good way to die earlier, but I’ll cover that later.  For now, penetrating fire is the same sin, and hence a full thirty isn’t always needed.
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Twice to three times the ammo is two to three times as long that you can kill the enemy.  NOT incapacitate, necessarily.  Ideally, you try to create a situation where you are not surrounded by the enemy, where you need a battle rattle of 300 rounds in tacti-cool speedy pouches.  If you are only firing at an exposed target, you don’t need all that.  But, if you are disregarding everything I’ll say about tactics fitting the logistics, you ALSO need to stick with the shorter carbine rounds.  Close quarters and excessive engagement isn’t the full bore thirties forte anyway. 
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You don’t even need a thirty if you are using an AR, anyway.  It will reach further than you can see without a scope.  And it doesn’t matter if it incapacitates or not.  You have the distance to escape and evade, and in time the even minor wound will finish him off ( or her, because goddess forbid we aren’t all equal and crap here ).  Widespread antibiotics will not be available after a very short period of mass warfare, after the collapse.
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This is why I include assault carbines in with battle rifles.  Neither are great in all roles, but both can work marginally in all.  I don’t consider hunting a consideration, as all game will be gone very shortly.  It is cheaper to store meat, and more realistic.  Don’t buy a bigger bore just for hunting ( you should be trapping anyway, not shooting ).  Survivalists need extra rifles ( of different configurations, not speaking of the same types-because, you know, one is none ) like they need an extra  hole in their head.  Pick what works for your area and skill ( and budget, obviously ) and double down on that.  If you are average, you’ll barely get proficient on one type of combat gun.  Let alone two.
( .Y. ) 
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23 comments:

  1. 100 yard or closer shots are exactly the reason I want a large caliber round. Just wounding someone at those ranges does not leave a lot of time for E&E. Also, while you have the boxcar winds, back east we deal with brush. And you are right, if I could get my hands on a M79 and a supply of rounds, I would be a lot happier

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    1. You have an excellent point. My only counter is that were one using carbine rounds, an ambush should in theory allow good enough escape options. Or a one shot and hunker down. Or really good shot placement.

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    2. An ambush would imply I am looking for a fight. My plan is to keep that to a minimum, and to break contact with as few mouths to tell the tale left to talk if it does happen.
      Of course the best laid plans rarely survive first contact, so the carbine might come in handy later.
      If I get everything else in order, I probably would get a carbine just to say I have one, it just isn't that high on the list right now.

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    3. I don't feel naked without a carbine. They didn't do much for me, ever. If the rifle/ammo is too heavy, carry less crap.

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  2. Yes Jim. If a Minion is already invested in 30 caliber battle rifle categories solely at this juncture in the collapse then I would say stay with it and stock up. It may be almost too late to diversify and change or add to weaponry inventories. If a Minion is into the intermediate calibers (common military calibers of course) for whatever reasoning then it is good to go, and certainly can make it work well, with training AND tactics. I was fortunate to have had some time and spend my money my way to get a gun heavy inventory. That only helps with optional choices of tools, not the cure all or end all to the problem of collapse, die off, warfare issues, etc. "Race with what you brought".

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    1. It is easy to see the other green grass. If you have a carbine, more power. If you have a big bore, cheaper ammo. But I certainly wouldn't bet on having time to switch over. I'm having good luck on researching the low power rounds option for the Enfield. Red Dot powder and a $25 bullet mold for 32ACP and I could be golden. Not sure if I'll through with it, but almost as cheap as rimfire if I do invest. Best of both worlds.

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    2. "It may be almost too late to diversify"

      I read a comment elsewhere that estimated "go time" is less than 2 years away (based on elections... it was from a militia type blog).

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  3. Jim good points made here. I like old school guns myself. I would prefer to carry an M-1 Garand and 1911 45 auto around the countryside as I make things right. I, through study and situation assessments must settle for what is practical and realistic. The a.r.-15 may be a "necessary" choice for all around go to purposes. The commonality/parts/ease of repairs/light weight-higher ammo load carrying ability,etc are attributes that are hard to dismiss in the larger picture of things. I only intend personal/neighborhood security, with rare varmint/ hunt opportunities envisioned. A rare chance of harassment fire, or a blocker flank at an ambush upon opposing forces is within my limitations. An average Minion with base skill/equippage will be more than capable to handle things just by applying attitude.

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    1. "handle things just by applying attitude"
      But...why work smarter when you can work harder? :)

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  4. A bolt action anything for a deer or elk. A 22LR or trap for rabbits a shotgun for assholes and a 9mm for anything that comes through the door while you are reloading. People need to get past the Mad Max/Rambo/Purge fantasies and get real. It ain't rocket science!

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    1. Are you SURE it ain't rocket science? It sure seems like it by this long ass fight against fighting the last war using oil age logistics.

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    2. RP - Firearms distilled to four sentence. How on earth do you intend to charge $5.99 for the e-book? ;-)

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  5. I can't emphasize enough the amount of research that went into my AR15 build. I read and viewed a LOT for 2 years before I started throwing money around. I used an M16 in the army back in the 70's and then never seen that platform again up close and personal until about 6 years ago when my neighbor bought some. I already had plenty of guns and ammo and I had been a long range shooter for a couple decades, but I didn't have a battle gun, at least not what I thought a modern day battle gun should be. So I started researching the AR15. The more I researched the more disappointed I got. There is an OVERWHELMING amount of bullshit out there and I imagine a lot of neophytes get caught up in it and lost their asses. This is the part where I remind you of the previous post where we talked about how much quality costs now a days. In the modern day battle rifle genre $500 doesn't go very far and in the AR platform specifically you're not even halfway there. I didn't set out to spend close to $3k for my gun but I knew what I wanted and the research dictated the cost. And this is not a top of the line gun with all the bells and whistles to bog you down. You can easily spend a lot more and get less. Research, research, research.

    While I am disappointed in how much a decent AR15 costs in reality I am not disappointed in the choices I have made and the performance of the gun. So far it has proven to better than I planned and if it continues to do so I will be content. I have almost 4k in rds through it at this point and not a single misfire of any type. I put 800 rds through it before I cleaned it the first time. I have used the same brass ammo brand and specs throughout and currently have about 4k rds on hand. Probably not the best deal in cost and performance but as I said, so far it works very well. Nothing worth having is inexpensive any more gentleman so get over it. Notice I said inexpensive, not cheap. There's a diff. Inexpensive costs less, but cheap is junk no matter the cost.

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    1. I agree with Commander Zero. A cheap AR is the same as a Mosin-Nagant. It is a crap rifle that is a BTN. Considering that an M14, good HK91 clone or FN-FAL is the same price as a good AR, the AR in my view is great for two things. Getting an updated Mosin-Nagant or making your own without paperwork. As a battle rifle it leaves much to be desired. Again, depending on the price point you pick. If $350 is all you can afford, you understand this is either your butter knife gun or that you better avoid most combat by whatever means. I don't think $1500-$2k is unreasonable for an AR, because that is just 90's prices adjusted for inflation. I just don't think you are getting enough for that price when the alternatives are better.

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  6. “Survivalists need extra rifles like they need an extra  hole in their head”


    Sounds a lot like Jim Brady’s response when asked about how he felt about his job:

    “I must have had a hole in my head for taking this job. If I had half a brain I’d leave” :D
    (Yeah, I know; it’s really not funny. So consider it a dig on that bitch wife of his).

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    1. Oh, no, it's funny! You take out other peoples personal suffering from humor, and you don't have anything that is funny.

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  7. On leather subject from other day: for Leather and leather tools, I avoid Tandy unless I absolutely have to use them.
    Tandy is the Harbor Freight of the leather work world, minus the cheap prices. Crap tools from the People's Factory #13 at a price 60 to 90 percent of what a great USA tool produced by the small independents costs.
    If you get serious about leather work or are making it a part time profession, check out small companies. Look at Ron's Tools for edgers, Hidemaster for round knives and swivel knives, Barry King for everything he makes, Bruce Johnson for an extensive line of vintage tools such as Gomph, Rose and the older C.S. Osborne stuff.

    For one or two time use: Tandy.

    For heirloom quality tools that perform 10 times better on expensive leather and are a joy to use, search out the independent leather tool craftsmen.

    Also on the actual leather, try ordering what you want directly from tanneries. In US, the excellent Wicket and Craig is a great choice. Buying an entire side can cost about $200 but goes a long way. You can request leather samples or for a few bucks buy a complete sample square selection of what they produce.

    On possible cobbling in our future of scarcity: I have mentioned Barge Cement before for repair and new shoe making. Excellent to have on hand.
    Another alternative adhesive that is damn near Barge's equal, but safer for your health and without the fumes: Renia-Aquilim 315 from Germany (can get from Rocky Mtn. Leather Supply).

    Aside from tires for sandals, possible rubber source for treads is conveyer belt material. I have seen with ridges. Maybe a future salvage idea in the right circumstance. I know Tractor Supply near me has a few rolls. Not thick like the bottom of a running shoe, but could be used on simple shoes and to extend the life of moccasins.
    Also have seen sheets of crepe rubber soling sold online.
    S

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    1. I bought one of those M-44's. thought it would freak out the locals at the gun range if I practiced bayonet charges while targets were being changed

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  8. Rifle: long barrel + shoulder stock, can use skinny bullet or fat bullet, big cartridge or compact cartridge.

    Carbine: shorter barrel than rifle + shoulder stock, same bullet-cartridge options.

    BATFE calls these, along with long-barrel shotguns, "long arms", so as not to baffle their Agents.

    Pistol: handle with short barrel, cartridge and bullet size-shape-power limited to strength of shooter hand/wrist.

    Mutant combo things like 2-gripped pistol-caliber sub-machine/bolt guns are not standard, but fun for special applications.

    I built a clone of an M16a2 with a 20" barrel (as Stoner intended) and it is a RIFLE. 62 grains needs to go fast to do a job. With scope and mags, very similar weight (as much as a mule can carry) to FAL system, but with more bangs.

    The Monkey-Nugget M-44 (that I despised) was a long-ish carbine boltie only when compared to the long-barreled rifle M91. Worth $79 and little more, and only when the Hungarian Heavy Ball was a nickel each in war-proof tins. Short barrel made huge boom and flash when compared to long barrel.

    Savage Rascal is lightest and most fun. Slow reload makes for a careful ammo-conserving shot. It's "only a nickel" now, but not forever.

    If you are going to get in and out of motor vehicle cabins, a rifle is inconvenient. If you are going to fight from inside a vehicle, a rifle is awful. That's a pretty big assumption to make (that you will have fuel to run a vehicle, yours or stolen, for more than the tank that comes with it), to sacrifice the feet-per-second effectiveness increases of a long barrel.

    Ultimately, if you have a weapon to go with your Mass Quantities of ammo and some cleaning service supplies, you are going to make a securing action or door-to-door visiting expensive for the OpFor. The current resale value of a working weapon is of no consequence when there is no market to sell to or buy from.

    pdxr13

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    1. Yep, the Mosin-Nagant in carbine was a pretty retarded weapon. I'm surprised the CIA didn't give that one to Oswald. Why not, in theory anything can fire a magic bullet. I'd also agree, make your AR a 20" or don't bother except if its a Butter Knife carbine.

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    2. At one time a company sold a tec .22 and 9mm. seems they would work from a car

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