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Thursday, April 9, 2020

PEEv2c17


PEEv2c17
Caching
Caching used to be easy, greasing up a gun, throwing it in a PVC pipe and burying it below the frost line. Well, PVC pipe got stupid expensive. You are literally looking at $50-$75 in a larger diameter pipe ( for a rifle ). Anything over four inch diameter is too expensive for the poor boy burying a budget gun ( got a two grand rifle? Yeah, I'd pay the extra for the PVC myself ). Twelve years on-post $140 oil-and plastic PVC pipe never went back to being affordable. Well, as all you Jarheads say ( those still capable of thought after removing the stick out of your ass ) overcome and improvise.
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When I first bought a vacuum sealing bag machine, I think they were about $75 at Wally, probably about seventeen years ago. It was name brand, and didn't survive deep storage. I had bought it because I was in a tiny fifteen foot RV and had zero storage room for five gallon buckets. I put the wheat in the vacuum bags and hide them in every nook and cranny. BTN. Once I became concerned about gun confiscation ( the good old days of planning for perceived threats instead of real ones ), I needed another unit. This time it was only $30.
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I sealed my rifles in the long plastic rolls. Do NOT just place in a single bag. Double bag it. I had sealed them, then left them for a few days. Just to make sure. And as sure as God made little green apples, on the forth or fifth day one of the bags lost its seal. There are a lot of sharper edges the bags are exposed to. You could just seal the bag, without first sucking the air out ( the unit has both settings ), but I liked the idea of a greased piece of metal also being voided of oxygen. Granted, you could use oxygen absorbers.
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You could just buy the plastic rolls, and the oxygen absorbers. Seal the bag with a clothes iron ( I'm not sure if you'd use a cloth or tinfoil covering the bag and then heat through that-I'm sure YouTube has plenty of instructions ). I chose the vacuum sealing machine because I was also sealing all my ammo ( why bury guns if you don't have any buried ammo for it? ) and when all that was done I'd start sealing meat with it. Of course, Beer Virus came along and it was hard to buy meat after the grocery store runs, but I still have a full freezer and my old method of storing meat has held up well.
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For you folks new here, I took my cut of meat and put it in the bottom of a plastic grocery bag. Take the bag above the meat and twist it, then fold the bag back down and around the meat again. Tie off the ends, pulling tightly around the package. You've double bagged it, with no air inside. Before I perfected my rotation system, we had a few packs escape detection. Three years later they only had a small spot or two with freezer burn that had to be cut away. But usually there is just six months of meat in a regular size freezer, and there is no freezer burn. Compare that to the one week in a zip-lock.
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There is other neat uses for the vacuum seal bags. Even the thick bags that store bought jerky comes in ( I have the homemade jerky vacuum sealed and hidden in the bottom of the fridge crisper. I'm reluctant to break the seal, so it lasts longer than zip lock bags full of sweet delicious meat treats ) get placed in another vacuum bag, to go past the expiration date, for BOB use. But, as I said, you don't necessarily NEED the machine. It is more convenience than necessity. Those oxygen absorbers also create a vacuum in the bag ( or Mason jar if using there ).
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Once I have my double bagged item to be buried, I then surround it with a puncture barrier. Your luck, the ONE rock in a mile of your burial site will find its target, like a Tremors Graboid. I've used cardboard but I don't like that. I've also used old pants that my old fat ass has grown out of. And I mean grown WAY out of, like a half dozen waist sizes. Well, that could be three sizes, as I think they are in increments of two. I'm not a beached whale. The ideal is to use a non-absorbent material. I've heard of a yoga mat being used.
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But, needs must and I just play the odds. I have TWO thick plastic vacuum bags around the gun, then tape wrapped cardboard, then place that into a huge contractor garbage bag, which wraps around three times, then is completely wrapped in package tape. Then buried in the desert. I'm pretty sure they will be okay. Yes of course I'd prefer PVC pipe. Who wouldn't? But you know, I've been experimenting and I can confirm that yes indeed, crapping in one hand ALWAYS fills up faster than wishing in the other. That pesky physics thing. As to ammunition, the set up is similar.
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I take a case of ammo, and each stack of five boxes of 556 gets vacuum sealed in its own bag. I place that back in the cardboard box the same way. After I have lined the box with a regular kitchen trash bag. Once bagged and replaced, with the trash bag taped, I close the case box and wrap the crap out of it in packaging tape. Then place the whole thing in the thickest fifty gallon black lawn bag I can buy, wrapping it up several times with the excess bag, then package tapping that all around. I'm guessing it takes about $5 or $6 in material per $190 case price, which is a bargain for burial.
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Now, I don't know if I'd trust this method in clay soil that gets fifty inches of rain a year. I'd figure out something else, worthy of surviving at the bottom of a lake. And then try to find more sandy soil ideally on an incline. Or bury under a house or slab. Luckily, ammo stores just fine in a 4 inch PVC pipe. Some parts of your rifle, as well. Perhaps something like the receiver in a gallon mayonnaise or pickle jug, extra plastic on the part, extra tape around the lid, extra trash bags outside. I don't think lack of the larger PVC is an insurmountable issue. It isn't ideal, but it also isn't a deal breaker.
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Bury your guns and ammo. Keep one above ground for instant use, but bury the others. And I'd be burying as much as I could, not just guns. Food, cash, coins, clothes, etc. The future will be too Spicy to do otherwise. Expect invasion, theft and fire to occur regularly.
END BOOK
( .Y. )
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33 comments:

  1. There is a saying, something like "If you think it is time to bury your guns, now is the time to use them". Rough quote that has been butchered over time. Do I agree with this? No on a few points. I concur with your thoughts.

    Burying or hiding and spreading the caches out will help make sure something is left after theft, fire, or some kind of confiscation (theft at gun point). This is just another type of insurance.

    Good reminder Ye of the magnificent hair


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    1. We need more insurance than ever, because Dog knows what all these idiots are going think the next best idea for Beer Virus is.

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  2. Right, a Minion has to be their own safe deposit box, in ability to store and safeguard his or her own stuff. Just to contribute, ensure your opsec is as solid as the storage methods used. No living witnesses to your cache location and contents. Best if it is on your owned free and clear real estate. If remote located consider variables. The hills have eyes so do not assume your jaunt into the boonies with shovel and crates goes unnoticed. (The pimply drone operator will scratch out the coordinates of your activity, minions glowing in the flir cameras shoveling away, and visit it later when off duty with his own chums) A hobbyist dork with a metal detector will troll any areas where humans have been or is accessable, they are like that, thinking they will find pirate treasure. Maybe tossing junk metal at the cache near the surface will throw off a scent, and help you know your spot on at retrieval time. A little well rounded life boat type of kit with related gear for a resupply is foresight thinking, surely needed during your escape and evasion flight from the authorities. I used thick 4 mil type of rolled drop cloth type plastic sheeting as a inner wrapping around the oiled up guns for those sharp edges and protrusions. Then vacuum sealed that bundle in the bag. Worked o.k. ymmv it takes magyver experimenting to see what works best for each scenario. Stay cached and frosty.

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    1. Damn, I think your method is superior. But I would have had to get wider bags for that anyway. Well, I made a lot of compromises in my rush, over the years. But a world to the wise, those just starting.

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    2. Yeah, 11 inch wide size rolls are needed for most work. I use food saver brand unit and those branded rolls. (Great value walmart or other generics seem flimsy thin, they fail too easily) I make those into whatever length total of bag I need. (Sealed up an m4 poodle rifle in a long bag, holding seal for years) Easier to make to size than getting the pre cut bags. I make >two< heat sealings on each end (the bottom seal of bag to start gets two spaced sequential sealings, then a second seal just *after* the machine created seal upon vacuum packing, just give yourself a little type of margin distance to work with to factor that in, tuck the opening end fully into machine as much as possible when starting the vacuum operation, it helps giving more space for another "back up seal" for redundancy) It gets addictive and you will run out of rolls cause you sealed everything and anything that fits in them, just because you can.

      Mericans being weird about muh guns probably have half of the national private arsenal inventory in deep storage as such for the future Wolverines kids to go spicy sports with. Minions are encouraged to do their part as well for spicy festivities planning. Stay the more frosty.

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    3. Addictive. Yeah, I was looking abound for stupid crap to seal before I got over the new toy issue.

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    4. I recall Kurt Saxon suggesting that you should bury loads of scrap metal on your land, which would have the added desire of driving the .gov butt weasels insane. I forgot how he worded it, but it was funny. Of course now, the bastards have that new fangled ground penetrating radar.


      “If remote located consider variables. The hills have eyes so do not assume your jaunt into the boonies with shovel and crates goes unnoticed.”


      Yeah, that’s what I was wondering too? I planned on excavating at night on my junk land, but that doesn’t protect you from the satellite FliRS. At least I’m assuming that the satellites have FliR capability? Anyone have any advice on how to foil that?

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    5. Who would analyze such a info dump? Everything you've ever done is recorded, but until they have a need to analyze it there is little need to worry

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  3. The idea of burying guns and ammo has never set well for me.
    If the location is such that burying is a consideration then the location needs to change.
    A buried gun can't save your life, and it can give you a false sense of security.

    I have also never been a fan of the idea of using a bolt to slow down wasteful firing.
    I believe training trumps all things.
    I also believe discounting a semi-auto is short sighted.
    The terms spray and pray and poodle shooters were invented by gun grabbers and soi bois and have no place with serious people.

    We now have a growing group of outsiders sort of inside the wire around here so surveilance is ongoing all the time.
    The people across the road.
    2 years ago a late 30's married couple from southern Calif moved in and spent $200k remodeling it. In the past month they have allowed 2 families to move there with their giant travel trailers and motor homes. There are now about 15 people living there. According to google maps it is 640' from their front door to our. Too close for comfort. The next closest neighbor after that is over 1000'.

    Yes, I need to be able to get as much lead downrange as fast as possible and so does everyone else because no one knows how the situation around them can change over night. 6 weeks ago I was not concerned about a flu nor neighbors, now I am. What other new concerns will I have in the coming months?

    What's worse than needing to bury guns?
    Needing to dig them up, FAST!

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    1. We disagree on much, but to each their own. No one, least of all me, wants to see Jim clones anywhere :) Gott Damn neighbors! Sad Panda :( Best of luck

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    2. If your a.o. government has useful but not onerous zoning regs, they can be made to work for your interests. (Worth researching for your own intel anyway) If neighbors are in violations of codes, >and< they are not conducive to your liking, screw 'em and anonymously sic the .gov code enforcers on them. Yeah it is nanny state tactics but if the regs are already on the books, use them. It is pre-emptive tactics to employ against an obvious future adversary by means of using .gov as the instigators, they are paid by us anyway for such work, keeping your hands clean in early stages. 15 people sounds like subversive activities of some sort, flag it as an intel package to your local fusion center, or snoopy leo agencies, they like the tips. This may help before you have to go monkeywrenching on your own with a bigger problem later. Playing for keeps at this point in pre spicy times. Just spiffing it out there for Minion study. Stay frosty.

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    3. Sounds like the SoCal neighbors across the street thought they found the perfect "last stand" location just like you did when you first moved there. They probably think that since they "own" their house, and they now have numbers on their side, that they will end up having the final say on neighborhood activities and resource allocation over existing long-term neighbors once full lock down mode is implemented. "We live in a democracy don't ya know!" I'm trying to think up a way to discourage them from thinking they can run the neighborhood without making them mad and turning them into enemies, haven't thought of anything yet.
      Romans 14:11

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    4. People are bastard coated bastards with bastard filling. How are you supposed to work with that?
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTbgvYPVdXE

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    5. Anon 3:45 I like that idea. Single family properties around here. Sucks for them but I dealt with neighbors allowing their refugee scum friends to stay after Katrina. My family was feeding 20+ people after the storm as I knew it was short term. Some refugees had the gall to bitch about Peas being nasty. Kinda snapped on that one with "If you don't like it don't eat it but don't complain about it". Told them not to come back to my table. They left shortly after. I moved to the sticks and still have friends in the old hood but they have never been here. Sorry went of on a tangent..

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    6. I've lived on my dead end street out in the county for 26 years now. Everyone on the street is pretty chill, minding their own business, but still we pull together when the need arises. In the last few years we've had some new people move in and build on what was once a vacant parcel. They built McMansions and brought their blue state views with them. The latest installment in the sh!tshow is a new guy who wants to form an HOA and get us all to pitch in $10K to have our old road resurfaced (he let it slip to one neighbor that the real reason was so his property value would increase.) The pushback on those proposals have been pretty strong and helped to reveal everyone's true colors.
      I've thought about moving but as Lord Bison has noted, there are no perfect place anymore (and if there was, it would ruin it by moving there myself) and not enough time left to become an accepted part of that sort of community. So here I stay with neighbors I know I can trust and those I know I can't...but at least I know who is who.

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    7. Definitely not the time to be playing-stick with the devil you know, if possible. And there are few folks you can trust that you want to hold on to those you do.

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    8. NS-you're a better man than I. Even in normal times I couldn't handle having that many people around me.

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    9. "Definitely not the time to be playing "stick with the devil you know", if possible."

      I agree with you to a point, LB, and am glad you added the caveat. But there's a factor with my situation I that didn't mention in my OP. If I were in the city it would definitely be time to hit the road. But I'm out here in the county where it is legal to shoot on your own property, and several neighbors do. Some of those have quietly confided in me their opinions on these new folks. Terms like "we'll just have to burn them out" and "at least they're creating a target-rich environment" have come up. Rural folks in this state are already fed-up with unresponsive government folks in the major cities who ride roughshod over the rural folks and pander to the small percentage in the liberal city cores. The city and state government people who are causing them grief remain out of reach, but these liberal neighbors would certainly serve as useful proxies to vent their frustration on if the situation ever reached the point where such action could be taken. The animus is palpable and if those folks are serious (as many rural folks in the county are), the problem may resolve itself rather quickly when things go non-linear.

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    10. This probably goes against the Bison bible of doing everything as cheaply as possible. But if it’s in your budget, get enough land to avoid the neighbor rule. The amount depends on the type of land. If it’s flat land for as far as the eye can see, you’re going to need a lot of it. Try to avoid such land (unless of course you can get it very cheaply). Try to avoid thin, rectangular lots of land (i.e. land that may be vast in acreage, yet the potential to have someone build next to you exists). And yes, I’ve seen such parcels for sale before. A ¼ mile strip of land, a 150’ wide. Not good. Also, try to avoid land with a common access road to many properties, but rather, be able to access it directly from a county road. Otherwise, you end with the same problems as mentioned by 6:38 PM above, where some yahoo wants to add in a road bond.

      If you can afford it, fence it. This keeps most people and squatters away. It also prevents a group of yahoos, from casually cruising up to your doorstep in 4x4’s or ATVs, one fine day.

      Short of the first 14 years of my life, I’ve lived in the country my entire life. We’ve had both good and bad neighbors. Good neighbors, while a joy to have, also limit certain activities (such as target shooting at all hours of the day). I’d prefer no neighbors.

      My 2.5 acres of land is crap. And it’s at least 5 miles away from power and water. As such, it will probably never build up (I hope?). Yet, at least one person out there has a nice compound in that development, that includes an expensive looking metal building. As such, I do worry about future development. Had I just bit the bullet, and got more land, it wouldn’t be an issue, and I’d be worry free. Sorry for the length. I thought that it might be of some use to some of the minions. Over the years, I have looked at many parcels, and these are my own anecdotal observations.

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    11. 5:57-it was "not the time to be playing-slash-stick with the devil you know" So in other words, "no time to do anything else BUT stick with the devil you know. Don't gamble". I worded it poorly at first. Sorry

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    12. 7:24- I hear you and agree with all. It is just more theory than practicality. Too far away and you trade neighbors for car dependency. It is hard, but all of us-me especially-need to learn to accept what we have, where we are, as Good Enough, Carry On. Dreaming is a hard habit to break, I know.

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    13. @7:24 a.m. - About not owning land where neighbors can traverse it, even with benign intent. Here in Colorado (and in other states, I assume, though I haven't researched it) there have been cases where "neighbors" (technically so, but certainly not in the spirit of a true neighbor) have stolen adjacent parcels under "adverse possession" legal means. Here's an example that made the news here some years back: https://www.denverpost.com/2007/11/25/land-seizure-cases-no-rarity/

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    14. Yeah, I get where you’re coming from Jim. In my case, I’m a hopelessly unemployed, straight white dude in his 50’s (Not trying play the sympathy card, but let’s face it; we’re at the bottom of the hiring hierarchy) so trips to town are less than they would be for most people. Now the goal, once I’m out there full time, is to make annual trips to Elko for stock up. I do have the motorized bicycle, but you can’t haul enough to last for very long on one of those. I also need to make water runs. In my case, I just happen to have an old Jeep Cherokee, that’s been sitting around here for years. It’s a complete piece of crap in most ways, but many years ago when I was still gainfully employed, I put a new engine, clutch, and pretty much everything else engine related into it, and have barely driven it since then. So mechanically speaking, it’s fairly reliable. As such, I feel that it would be foolish to sell it. Especially since when it last blue booked, I had more money into it than I could sell it for. But if I didn’t have the Jeep, I’d probably just rent a truck once a year. The goal is to be able brave any future pandemics, as the economy is shut down, once again. I’d also like to shoot for a years supply of drinking water. For hygiene, I’ll just shave my head, and use sanitary wipes for a sponge bath. Unless of course I get really dirty, and I need to use some water. But I’ll try and keep my water use at a minimum.

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    15. I could survive on two gallons of water a day. That isn't much more than two IBC totes full of rain water from catchment ( if no roofs, I was going to try out ferrocement slab on the slopping ground ). One more tote might give you limited gardening. Your plan sounds rather doable to me-you are probably starting out on a better footing than I did, except the lack of income for the shelter, and more advanced age trying to dig.

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    16. 8:49-I read in Arkansas, if a person squats on your land-I think five years-they can end up owning it. Lesson-if it's a retirement home, make sure you use it as a vacation home also. Even camping in your car.

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    17. @8:49 AM. I gleaned through your link. That is some f@#$ed up Sh!t there! I think I’ll be looking into putting my land under an LLC, if it’s not too expensive to do so.


      @Jim. Fortunately, I was able to sell off a former property, so I have a small nest egg in which to work with. This might sound good to some, since technically, I have far more in savings than most Americans. But.... It’s likely all that I’ll ever have for the rest of my life, and it’s not much. The key is to use as little of it as possible, to get done, what I need to get done. At this point, I’m not expecting to see a dime of social security(6 years away, if I collect at age 62). But of course, I hope like hell I’m wrong.

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    18. Assuming the worst and living frugal always=winning

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    19. I think it’s likely you’ll get social security. Weather the money is going to be worth much is another story.

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    20. Crap! Can't even get an Orange Man Check.

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  4. Looking forward to you putting this series into an ebook that will be available for purchase.

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    1. I'll put it on kindle to buy, or it will be free on PDF at the web site. It only takes a few hours to do, although I always dread the PITA. But I'll get to it soonest.

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  5. If you are going to store your rifles in vacuum seal bags and worried about losing the seal, wrap your rifle a few times with shop towels. This way the sharper edges will be covered.

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    1. I was in a hurry and had 8 inch bags. Should have waited for 10 inch.

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