Monday, August 19, 2019

bury guns


BURY GUNS
Hey, hey, blah, blah. Burying guns-yawn. Of course, even the simplest tasks are difficult and not very obvious when you first undertake them, and I've never buried steel before. Silver, sure. No big deal-a Ziplock bag in a plastic jar and if they still end up tarnishing, whoopie pickles. I've buried buckets of food, also no big deal. Well, okay, to be fair the second huge advantage ( after lots less people ) of living in the desert ( the third would be great night vision with the unobstructed stars ) is that the dirt stays dry. So, I don't deal with huge burial issues.
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If you are back in the East, you do have to beware of wet clay or standing water. Of course, the old French dudes settling lower Canada had near swamps in a lot of places and they introduced us to caches ( at least the term, if not the practice ), and they were successful without plastics, so stop your bellyaching. My take on this is as follows. In the desert, I can probably get away without rigid waterproof pipe. Back east, probably not. The go to answer for caches always used to be PVC pipe, but a curious thing happened ten years ago when oil spiked to near $150 a barrel.
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Plastic got stupid expensive. And, it never really honest injun came down to were it should be if you just go by the cost of petroleum. Most likely, this mirrored the RV industry. Everyone consolidated and got a near monopoly and said Hump The Consumer, and quality crashed as prices spiked. Remember our talk about the Hammer Test on PVC pipe? Due to quality issues, you must test each brand. Set the pipe on a solid surface, and hit it with a steel hammer, hard. The good plastic will see the hammer bounce off. The craptastic plastic will crack.
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Anyway, you might possibly still get away with using crappy plastic just for burial. The test was from a guy that was talking about PVC pipe for use in archery. I just felt is was good to remind you of this, as knowledge is never wasted. But to continue, if you use a 4” PVC pipe, the fittings will be affordable. About $25 for the pipe and fittings for a six foot section. But if you go up to a six inch pipe, you are looking at about $40 just in the caps!!! Suck my junk and call me a lollipop, that is ridiculous and I don't feel like being violated in such a manner ( the lollipop part is okay, not the financial sodomy ).
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You can buy a ( 10 inch? ) monovault ( TankBarn.com ) for about the same cost of a 6” PVC pipe with caps. Call it a minimum of $100. I'm not saying protecting your gun isn't worth it. I'm saying, these fools are selling you pipes or vaults assuming you are burying intact guns. Why are you unable to partially disassemble your rifle? Are you REALLY going to sit there and tell me that you are going to be chased through the wilderness, dogs baying and Rebel Yells bouncing off the canyon walls, and need an intact weapon ready to go?
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You need time to find the spot, then to dig it up. Are you saying that you'll be unmolested while you dig it up, but not while you are fastening a few screws? If you disassemble the gun, which you in theory know how to do so you can clean it, you don't need such huge burial units. You can stick with 4” at a more reasonable price ( in theory ), with any furniture slightly bigger possibly going into a plastic bucket. And I'm not sure if I'd feel comfortable with some of my guns JUST covered in regular oil.
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They sell bags made especially for burying guns ( HERE ). You insert the oxygen absorber inside and seal it up and done. I'd feel comfortable with newer guns just wearing a coat of gun oil. But my older more ancient weapons I'd want a thick coat of axle grease. A small tub of the grease is $5 at the auto parts store, and a gallon of mineral spirits shouldn't be too much more ( you can use kerosene also-just have whatever already on hand so you aren't using gasoline or something else you salvaged ). I'm going to be using my vacuum sealer ( if it is still working, after 15 years stored ) instead of the Mylar bag, OR, I'll use one in the other, if I have space in the pipe.
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Vacuum sealer bags are NOT expensive. Not like they were pre-Amazon ( HERE ). I'd double bag it, for just a buck more ( 17cents a foot ). You just need something to keep the rocks off the bag. In one YouTube video, the guy burying in the desert wrapped it in a old yoga mat. I wonder if that plastic cardboard would work ( polypropylene )? Again, probably not for you folks in wetter climes. Did I mention I usually feel superior that I live in the desert and you don't? Since Europeans introduced sheep and goats, not a bad place to get away from the heathen masses.
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I like the idea of horizontal burial. For one thing, hiking off into the desert with a post hole digger isn't exactly all ninja stealthy. For another, I'm getting long enough on the tooth ( 55 is just a few months away ) that I don't know how well I could dig down through hard clay and rock. My B-POD was no easy dig ( even when I was a young stud ), and that was the softest patch of dirt on my acre. Other digs bottomed out at a foot and a half in near concrete like conditions. Just enough for buckets. Too near the surface for vertical burial ( and there is no way to tell what conditions you are digging into ).
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So, simply, you oil up your gun parts, throw them in a Mylar or vacuum seal bag, add oxygen absorbers, and then add to a PVC pipe and bucket. If you can't fit into a pipe, and want to chance that, the bag, in another one, which is then wrapped in a couple of garbage bags which is wrapped in a yoga mat or plastic cardboard forming a tube ( with the sides overlapping and taped shut to prevent rocks or pebbles from intruding ).
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Dig down as far as you can, but don't pick an obvious campfire or latrine spot. Do NOT rely on a GPS to mark the spot. If you must, make a map, which is then hidden in a vacuum seal bag in a plastic food jar which is buried closer in a more familiar spot. Do NOT assume you will remember where you buried the cache. Not unless you go to that spot regularly camping and can keep refreshing your memory. Memory works by repetition, the neural pathways reinforced as if they were muscles being exercised.
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I've watched vids on year and a half old guns and fifteen year old burials being unearthed and rust free. For a good site for reading about this, go to HERE . This is the next project after my soymeal. After the theft by crackheads at the B-POD, and after Orange Bitch supported Red Flagging, I'm burying almost everything ( ammo is buried just like guns, but without the oil, obviously ). As a bonus, I'll start hiking the wilderness again ( well, semi-wilderness ) which might get me interested in camping ( although no promises ). Getting shaken out of my rut will do me good.
( .Y. )
( today's related Amazon link click HERE )
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41 comments:

  1. I'm not a fan of burying guns here in Northern NH. The ground is hard and full of rocks. Then it freezes hard as concrete and disappears under feet of snow and ice. Don't want to wait six months to be able to dig up a gun.

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    1. Too late for the article, I remembered Rawles last book before he totally went Full Retard, with guns being sealed up in walls. That has got to be somewhat successful, I would imagine.

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    2. Not in walls, or in structures, or aside combustibles, (hand held scanners by tptb, fire- floods- or oops incidents finds your stash) or where future garden digging may occur, or any and all of those things that taking that pause and break, walking away and coming back to reconsider all the angles. Just saying.

      Oh yeah, Stay Frosty.

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    3. God, you're correct and hence depressing.

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  2. Jacob Waltz in the making.

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    1. Ha! Had to look that one up:
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Dutchman%27s_Gold_Mine

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  3. Yeah, I’ve noticed that when you start getting into the bigger PVC pipe that it becomes astronomically expensive. As far as being brittle goes, you must keep it out of direct sunlight, and then it will last for years. It seems that all the industries use that cosmoline grease, but that might be due to cost effectiveness. I’ve thought about getting one of those cabinets, that’s disguised as an ordinary piece of furniture, but is really a secret gun cabinet. The Sportsman’s guide has them. But I don’t like the idea of buying such an item if there is any possibility of a paper trail, so I’d probably have to build my own from plans. The problem is, I suck at that sort of thing. But of course, you would only want to store some of your guns in this furniture.

    The burial on property other than your own, at least eliminates the worry of the ground penetrating radar. But I don’t like the idea of burying weapons on public land. Though in reality, they would probably be safer. If you’re buying guns new, look for the take down feature. My Rossi gallery gun breaks in two. So do the AR-7’s.

    Camping huh? Sounds interesting. Lamoille canyon/Ruby hills area? When I get out there I’ll be checking that area out. If it’s nice enough, I just might go semi-full time nomad in those hills, and use my Elko land as a resupply/winter over headquarters. I’d imagine that you would see few people in those hills, and that can’t be a bad thing.

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    1. Lamoille and South Fork are two Go-Two places for every swinging dingus and his brother. I need to find another spot.

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    2. Again, not stored in domicile structure, or where exposed to any and all (wacky as it may sound, the California guy that had a hole structure dug under his house/garage filled with guns, just because, had his stash confiscated, due to a normal house fire having those calender boy first responder hunks digging around your castle and ratting you out to their butt buddies in law enforcement, oh gee! Look what we found!) Plan accordingly.

      Oh yeah, Stay Frosty!

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    3. All those First Responders get their paycheck from the same people. And we wonder why the hood rats shoot at firemen ( "don't put it out let the MoFo burn!" )

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    4. “Lamoille and South Fork are two Go-Two places for every swinging dingus and his brother. I need to find another spot.”


      Sorry to hear that. I’ve noticed for a long time now, that anywhere that’s worth going, and has even semi-easy access, is usually way overcrowded now. You can head out on the 4x4 trails, and eliminate about 80% of the campers, but you still have to deal with those dedicated Jeep club faggots. The best option of all, is to backpack way in; as in 20 miles in. This eliminates practically everyone, but you still have to deal with those dedicated Sierra club faggots. My, it seems that there’s a lot of faggots in the woods these days :D But as long as I don’t run into those two hillbillies from Deliverance, I’m a happy camper. Guess I’d better bring Burt along, with his old school recurve bow (A real man, carrying a real bow. Not one of those dedicated compound bow faggots :D )

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    5. When did faggots go from Metrosexual to poser rural? Was it the flannel and beards? ( PS, don't tell the guys at Black Rifle Coffee Company I was making fun of beards )

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    6. Yeah, it’s a real thing Jim, and they actually have a name for them. They’re called “Lumbersexuals”. In short, they’re macho bearded fags, that dress like lumberjacks.

      So next time you’re in that rural diner, and the big bearded fellow asks you if you want to see “his wood”, politely decline, and run like hell in the other direction :D

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    7. Hmm. I guess there is such a thing as Too Much Information. :)

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  4. Good post Jim. I recommend minions take a long time cleaning the guns very thoroughly and work the bore well to pull all manner of carbon out of bore, and full gas systems as well for those Minions with degenerate proclivities toward semi auto guns. Carbon when captured in or with any moisture is a hastened corrosive effect. Oil bore well with break free (my fave, but others may have their snake oil special sauces) then use that grease dallop to grease plug the bores on each end when slathering it on. I did a vacuum sealer bag type storage bag on an ar 15 carbine stash gun, just oiled it up well, then seal wrapped up. Stayed sealed a few years just fine, was ready for duty if needed. Location selection will need be way off beaten path, as granola eaters are fleeing cities more frequently to commune with nature and most hinterlands now get trampled eventually by people that really should stay on reservations or be caged, including those dorks with fanny packs and metal detectors out there snooping for gibs, freebees, etc. Plan it all out, take a step back and re assess the details for failure possibilities, wait a bit of time to consider it all then proceed with plan. This stuff takes more thinking over than what to have for dinner. Life and death stuff yo.

    Stay frosty.

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    1. I never thought about it, but, yeah, what a bunch of dicks! Stinking metal detector scavs.

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    2. Scavengers and scabs that are not really destitute and hungry looking, wandering around like fat belly welfare queens on mothers day shopping trips during first of the month should be open season hunted at will. I despise Mooches that are like flies looking for free shit. (Free shit army, casino dregs wanting gibs, etc) I have to allow an expenditure of ammo stores for such scumbags just to get the traffic out of the way for readiness of actual combatant threats. Jeez!

      Stay Frosty.

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    3. Target practice to increase proficiency?

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    4. Not just civilian metal detectors, good for finding coins and jewelry, but "ground penetrating radar" has been a thing for at least a decade.

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    5. The thing is, do local LEO's use the radar for Red Flagging, or will it be more cursory?

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    6. They already fly over in planes and also have tower mounted 'stingray' devices to gather (all) comms in area. (The warrant was for ed's house, why not sweep up the whole street?) They will have the back scatter x rays in trucks out trolling the neighborhood. Like google street view, only their clear view will be of you on the toilet loitering there for too long and your flir ar15s glowing bright in your secret carpenter false wall. Duh. Like the band B.T.O. sez: "you ain't seen nothing yet".

      Stay Frosty.

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    7. Just like the underground pipe and conduit locators they have stuff that "reads" every character of the earth below to include finding oil way the heck down there. All tech has carry over uses and with DARPA etc, they have all the toys. We are so way screwed, badly. Well anyway, good luck.

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    8. Not concerns to be dismissed. My question is, where does the fear mongering hype stop? Far too often, tech weapons are way oversold. Like when "they" could find anyone at anytime by heat signature. More Hollywood than real WIDESPREAD danger.

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    9. "Far too often, tech weapons are way oversold. Like when "they" could find anyone at anytime by heat signature.”


      Oh yeah, there’s a way to foil this stuff, I just don’t know what it is. If this tech were so great, our military wouldn’t be getting it ass kicked by 6th century goat herders in Afghanistan, and we’d be ground penetrating “radaring” them in their caves :D I know that the infrared doesn’t function so well in hot weather, as one might expect. I recall that Kurt Saxon mentioned something about burying metal silhouettes in varying places about your yard, and that after enough fruitless excavation attempts, the searchers would lose their sanity:D Of course, this was long before ground penetrating radar. But there’s a way. There’s always a way.

      Places such as Paladin Press, or Loompanics originally published on such topics. Of course now, you can get these same publications through Amazon; that is until they ban them.

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    10. I haven't found any new writing that equals Paladin, let alone Loompanics. Even before banning.

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  5. I may be mistaken, but I believe the Viet Cong in Vietname cached their firearms and ammunition in rice paddies. A car / truck tire tube, folded and folded again at the ends was the container storing them. Like the kind the river riders use - not that bad a price but I have no idea how durable they are in long term burial.

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    1. I'm pretty sure they were very short term, just needing to avoid the upcoming patrol.

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    2. I'd bet that in soil vs. water, that rubber would work just fine. Of course you still cover metal parts in grease and place in plastic sleeve (Furniture or large car parts plastic sleeves are awesome !) inside the rubber tube. Place openings below the stored item to reduce chance of water rising into contained item.

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  6. I had something planted in PVC when I went away for about 4 years. In a public park. Depended on the best "permanent" landscape objects there for later retrieval. That one went smooth and I got it back one dark, stormy night.
    Burying is usually pretty secure, but be aware there is quite a chance whatever you bury will stay there forever. If you die, the stuff wont be going to your wife or kids. I've lost one cache to roadwork and development.

    If you bury off your own property, planting and retrieval must be planned and executed well. Maybe commando ninja stuff with blacked out faces is the answer for some situations. Sometimes an orange safety vest, hard hat, thick glasses, road cones and a clipboard during broad daulight might work best for a public land retrieval.

    One time I did a temporary cache in the last gun friendly state before Canadian border. Visited Quebec, then dug up shallow buried ammo box full of free person gear and continued back to Dixie.

    Also, don't know if this made any difference, but I purged the PVC tubes with CO2 from a tank before sealing. Cleaned and oiled everything well and included a homemade cloth bag full of silica gel.

    Eddie the Wire Jr.

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    1. One of the better books, Eddie.

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    2. PS-yes, I know its homage. The "Jr" tipped me off.

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    3. You can get dry nitrogen - the hot rodder kids used it to fill their tires - from any auto parts store. It comes in little cans. I don't know why anyone would use CO2.

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  7. Burying guns...meh!
    My WAG is minions are so far down the list that by the time "THEY" get to us we would've (should've) vamoosed out of current AO. News of large scale raids spreads like wildfire.

    Now of course, you, Lord Bison might be higher on the list as you are part of "leadership cadre", lol.

    Nope, the 870 pump stays standing behind the bedroom door.....that reminds me...need to dust it. Bwahaa haa.

    Catching up on old news....sorry to hear you've gone the soy meal route. 😳
    Have you considered garbanzo bean flour? It's used for humus.
    Since you are a desert denizen you might want to try. Add a bit of hot water & olive oil...presto, change-o you can pretend you're Lawrence of Arabia replete with your well lubed .303.

    Can't wait to see you you in a kayfee'yah!

    Lay back on a pillow under the goat hair tent. Pop an olive into your maw & use your whole wheat flat bread and scoop the humus (right hand only!).

    Interpet the cloud formations, divine the wind drawn sand patterns, dream the dreams mere mortal men fear...
    The Emir of Elko!

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    1. I know Baby Jesus loves me above all others, as I have proof in the pudding. Since I can't shake the feeling of dread, forcing me to purchase the bury guns, I can only conclude that He has sent a message to me direct like. I have to keep one Enfield on hand, but everything else gets buried. Hope I'm wrong, planning as if I'm right.

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    2. Spread out the caches. Some buried, where no one but you knows about it. Maybe one or three more with relatives or friends (TRUSTED relatives) who are beyond suspicion and can hold a package for you. Just explain you are scared of burglars and do not hold them responsible if they are found. Best would be unpapered.

      A good point made below - if you have to run away, your cache will very likely remain there, no time to dig out before leaving.

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  8. Go 50/50, no more difference in ratio of cache gear, whether in one cache or three, in an aggregate total that is no more than half of your on hand right now get jiggy kit at home, etc. As long as stored or sequestered inventory is out of immediate reach, it is off books and not of now use, so don't short change scenarios as one or all caches may be unobtainium behind enemy lines. There are too many reasons why to be too much in one direction or the other. It will also be a default lame explanation for only losing half of your life's and family treasure to internet advice. Just saying.

    Stay. Frosty.

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  9. The county sheriff where I live is spread pretty thin during normal times. I don’t get why they would be wasting time getting a hold of fancy tech equipment to look for hidden guns. The feds are not going to be interested in my boring corner of the middle of nowhere. Maybe there’s something I am missing. I am more concerned by routine theft than govt confiscation.

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    1. Could the same have been said of Randy Weaver's little Podunk Corner?

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    2. Remember that Mr Weaver brought attention to himself....
      Be the Grey Man.

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    3. I don't know-seems to me his only sin was being a escapist cultist. Not that I've read up on him for decades-my memory could be off.

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